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Couples Therapy, Session 2, Terry Real: Comment Board


terry_real_p003Welcome to Session 2 of Couples Therapy: Today and Tomorrow. During this session with Terry Real, you’ll get the opportunity to hear about how to help today’s couples develop the skills they need to achieve a high level of connection and emotional intimacy.

Real will discuss how to deal with the differences between what men and women contribute to relationships, how to identify the techniques that disrupt relationships, and how to present your observations as a therapist in an honest way.

As always, we invite you to participate in this Comment Board to share relevant experiences with couples therapy, comment on what was most interesting to you, and raise any questions you may have. What was most important to you about what you learned today?

Please include your name and hometown along with your comment. Thank you again for your participation and your comments.

02.16.2011   Posted In: P003 Couples Therapy: Today and Tomorrow   By Rich Simon
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    • 0 avatar liz colten 02.17.2011 07:10
      how does this approach get modified when the couple is ordered to couples counseling because of abusive parenting, they fit the latent/blatant model but they believe their relationship is 'perfect'....liz colten, colorado springs
      • Not available avatar 02.19.2011 09:01
        tough one, liz
        id bet a couple referred for abusive parenting who think their relationship is perfect is either both blatant or the latent is so codependent he or she is frightened to speak the truth
    • 0 avatar Carlton Brown 02.17.2011 07:14
      Looking at liz colten's comment, Alan Jenkins comes to mind, Invitations to Responsibility, perhaps joining with the couple around what is restraining them from seeing that their relationship is hurting their children, perhaps the couple is blatant and the kids are latent in this case.

      Anyway I loved Terry's presentation: funny, confirming, in a lot of ways modeled the "functional adult". I've been doing couples therapy for years and have struggled with the shame I feel whenever I supported the woman "against" the man. I have gradually learned a more nuanced approach to address the grandiosity and found in Terry's work the "royal road" which I have been laboring to find as I hack my way through the undergrowth. Thanks. Carlton Brown, Hamilton Ontario
      • Not available avatar 02.18.2011 05:59
        Thanks Carlton! No more shame! I love giving clinicians support for doing what their hearts moved them to do all along.
    • 0 avatar Dorothy Winrow 02.17.2011 07:15
      I think I will easily keep in mind the idea of loving truth telling and the idea of leverage v.s. alliance.
    • 0 avatar Loren Gelberg-Goff 02.17.2011 07:16
      Very good program... focused, clear and direct. Instead of using the focus of 1st and 2nd consciousness, I have told couples I work with that only one person can have a tantrum at a time... the first person to "act out" has dibs... from there it's the other partner who has to be the adult. People seem to relate to the idea of a "tantrum"... I do love doing couple's counseling and appreciate your insights and clarity to expand, deepen and reinforce my skills, knowledge and learning. Thank You. Loren Gelberg-Goff, River Edge
      • Not available avatar 02.18.2011 06:05
        Yes Lauren - I say, everyone gets to be childish but you have to take turns!
    • 0 avatar Charlie Love 02.17.2011 07:25
      Great information presented in logical, easy to follow manner. It is important to have skills to deal with blatant/ abusive types and Terry has clearly created a tactics to get their attention and investment in change. I liked his upfront, honest approach blending the heart and truth. Thanks, Terry
      Charlie Love, Austin, Tx.
      • Not available avatar 02.19.2011 08:59
        thanks for your kind words, charlie
        the conjunction of truth and love is what intimacy is - i find most therapy has one or the other but not both at the same time
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    • Not available avatar 02.17.2011 07:43
      I enjoyed the presentation. The concept of shame and grandiosity are novel ways of looking at what impedes quality relatedness between the couple. I will keep this in mind when I'm working with my couples. I like the techniques of holding up pictures of the children and speaking to the anger. Florence Calhoun, Los Angeles,CA.
      • Not available avatar 02.19.2011 08:56
        thanks florence
        you cannot be intimate from either the one up or one down positions
        you must have healthy self-esteem to truly love another
    • 0 avatar Dale Pavich 02.17.2011 08:23
      Thank you, Terry and Rich, for this very accessible and lucid approach to working with conflict-impacted couples. I wondered if you have any thoughts on working with hispanic men who characteristically value their "machismo" as part of their own cultural heritage and identity; particularly when it becomes confused or contaminated with grandiosity that manifests in abusive behavior and what you've termed "taking liberties"? Do you have a special approach for educating these types client families that honors such cultural norms without alligning with grandiosity and thus negatively impacting the relational rapport in the family system?? Any other resource materials on using RLT with non-anglo populations would also be appreciated. Thank you very much, Terry, for your dedicated and insightful work in this important aspect of family therapy!

      Dale Pavich, LCSW
      Santa Barbara, Ca
      • Not available avatar 02.18.2011 06:08
        I try focusing on aspects of machismo and of traditional masculitbity in general that call out the better parts of the guy - like being a good team player, being responsible, a good leader - the more leverage you have the more willingness ther will
        be to change
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    • Not available avatar 02.18.2011 08:15
      Having read the book it was great to hear Terry review the highlites. I especially like the example of the family of orgin idea the so many people are not behaving as they wanted. I find that since the better behavior represents a certin degree of mountain climing most would like to be acknowledged for that effort that is likely unknown to the mate. The mate just thinks that is the way to go such as not yell etc, but it can be a real effort to act differently. When you appreciate their efforts to be their better self it really creates a bound in therapy I believe. Thank you for this and more
      • Not available avatar 02.19.2011 08:53
        thanks - good comment
        in RLT we'd call this - cherishing your partner's progress
        i write about it in The New Rules of Marriage
    • Not available avatar 02.18.2011 09:42
      When the couple is not challenged by an affair or addiction, no "bad guy" is evident, just more ordinary issues of boredom, not communicating well, or general unhappiness in marriage, how do you determine the blatent and the latent?
      • Not available avatar 02.19.2011 08:51
        good question
        you don't always get a latent and blatant, sometimes you have two blatants, sometimes this particular lens is less applicable than other RLT lenses - remember there are six others
    • Not available avatar 02.18.2011 11:53
      Great webinar, at first the direct approach felt unauthentic for me, my style but it has grown on me and I appreciate the adaptive child vs. functional adult model. Thanks,
      Elizabeth Baratta LMHC Somerville, MA
      • Not available avatar 02.19.2011 08:47
        thanks elizabeth
    • Not available avatar 02.18.2011 14:25
    • 0 avatar Donna Vogeler-Boutin 02.18.2011 17:32
      Enjoyed this webinar very much. The rules are changing in couples therapy as women become more empowered in our culture. Nice to see the change. It appears to be a powerful modality determining the latent and the blatant. I did have difficulty understanding Terry. Maybe the mike was too close. Also the grid slide was really difficult to read. I will download the slides - I hope it won't be as difficult to read when I make a copy. Thanks
      • Not available avatar 02.19.2011 08:47
        as women change therapy must change as well - now let's see the men change too!
    • Not available avatar 02.19.2011 03:29
      I enjoyed the webinar. I thought Terry's focus on confronting the aggrandizing position directly, yet with humility, was crucial to repairing damaged ways of functioning.
      • Not available avatar 02.19.2011 08:44
        thank you - agreed.
    • Not available avatar 02.19.2011 03:36
      I appreciated being given permission, and a specific way to confront grandiose partners in the first session. I have felt incompetent in dealing with this very common phenomena, and have therefore limited the couples work I do. Its actually a way to empower myself as a female therapist. I plan to learn more about it. Thanks. Christina Veselak, Aurora, CO
      • Not available avatar 02.19.2011 08:43
        this is music to my ears - hearing you, as a female therapist, feeling empowered by this work. brava! its hard to impossible to work with grandiosity without a map. i will be in denver in a few weeks doing live work if you can swing it - love to see you there.
    • 0 avatar Lynn Pearlmutter 02.19.2011 04:07
      The work with grandiosity was very helpful. I agree that we see this partner very often. I am having a bit more trouble putting my arms around the other partner as usually "shamed". Calling it "pained" would work better for me. I see great linkages with your work with the grandiose partner and some of the concepts of motivational interviewing. Lynn Pearlmutter, New Orleans
      • Not available avatar 02.19.2011 08:39
        thanks lynn
        i don't know enough about motivational interviewing to say anything intelligent other than that others have told me the same.
        concerning the latent - i do not see him/her as in a shame state, necessarily. the latent can be healthy and just putting up with wildly unhealthy behaviors. so shamed sometimes, pained always
    • Not available avatar 02.19.2011 06:25
      Thanks, Terry. I was introduced to your work by one of my college friends of years ago. I found that it systematized what I have been doing and trying to do in my own practice. I find it integrative with a number of approaches though its use of perhaps a stereotypical masculine valence in the interest of relationship I find brings a more balanced and realistic approach to couples experience. Mark Napack, North Bethesda, MD
      • Not available avatar 02.19.2011 08:36
        thanks mark -
        i love hearing that my work helps people do what they've been (often rather secretively) doing already!
    • Not available avatar 02.19.2011 06:45
      Interesting model, treats both genders on a more equal footing than most traditional couples therapies, but don't see all couples fitting neatly into different quadrants on the grid. Some appear to shift back and forth along the spectrum of boundaries and self-esteem depending on factors outside the relationship. Really liked the use of 2nd consciousness as a strategy for helping couples to overcome obstacles to intimacy.

      Richard, NY
      • Not available avatar 02.19.2011 08:34
        thanks richard -
        concerning the grid, i tell people not to be too particular about it - pick the most predominant stance in this relationship right now - everyone does everything but most will have a predominant position
    • Not available avatar 02.19.2011 07:44
      Thanks Terry, I liked the blatant-latent concept. I agree you need to get the buy in from the grandiose partner. Thanks for making that explicit. It was hard to hear Terry at times, it was scratchy. Rich thanks for these webinars they are a gift. Renee, Minnetonka, MN
      • Not available avatar 02.19.2011 08:32
        thanks renee - buy in from the blatant comes after and is largely determined by how much leverage you have (which comes usually from the latent) first, leverage, then joining through the truth.
    • Not available avatar 02.19.2011 07:46
      Thank you for the very interesting presentation.
      Some of what was presented dovetails very nicely with the Internal Family Systems parts work that I use, which teachs mindfulnness and identifies many parts that are operative for both partners within a relationship, and which helps parts transform into more helpful roles in the relationship along with the "functional part".
      • Not available avatar 02.19.2011 08:29
        i totally agree. both models teach us to hold in observation with compassion difficult parts of ourselves. i hope to be co-presenting with richard schwartz later this year in boston - we're each going to interview one couple using our two different methods - should be powerful!
    • Not available avatar 02.19.2011 10:36
      I missed the 4 Steps that Terry Real mentioned right after the 5 Winning Strategies toward the end o fthe webinar. I found the relationship Grid very interesting and wish we had more tim eto hear how it worked. I found Terry's voice not as clear as Rich's. excellent pressentation. I love working w/ couples and have found this most helpful. Thank you! Jackie Sitte-Stoughton,MA
      • Not available avatar 02.20.2011 15:18
        Thanks Jackie.
    • Not available avatar 02.19.2011 13:43
      Great presentation. Thank you Terry for keeping it Real (ha) and giving me permission to confront the grandiose partner. As a female therapist I also realize it is appropriate modeling for the latent partner. Good stuff.
      • Not available avatar 02.20.2011 15:17
    • Not available avatar 02.20.2011 02:33
      I enjoyed the presentation very much, but have a question.
      I supervise therapy interns who intern in a domestic violence unit in Jerusalem, Israel. The unit's approach is that when there is concern that serious abuse is going on in a couple, the wife (since it's usually the wife that's abused, though not always) will feel unsafe to fully share with the therapist what is happening in the marriage, and we therefore, in such circumstances, work with each member of the coupleindividually for a while, until it is felt that the husband will not threaten the wife's safety, and the woman is more empowered to speak the truth in front of her husband. Any thoughts on whether to and how to apply your approach to couples where there is serious abuse going on?
      Gloria Mosenkis, MSW, SEP, Beit Shemesh, Israel
      • Not available avatar 02.20.2011 15:03
        I agree w your approach completely
    • Not available avatar 02.20.2011 03:48
      Thanks for a great presentation. How would you deal with a wife who's unhappy with her husband's abuse, but won't consider leaving the marriage, for financial reasons or for the children's well-being?

      Steven Guggenheim PhD, New Rochelle, NY
      • Not available avatar 02.20.2011 15:05
        Look for less drastic measures - no cooking, no sex, no socializing, no shared bedroom. There's a whole spectrum of negative consequences
    • Comment was deleted

    • 0 avatar Linda Marshall 02.20.2011 07:02
      I'm a female Imago trained therapist and have taken several teleclasses and a workshop with Terry over the years, and so he has informed my work. I am currently working with a couple where I needed to confront grandiose behavior in the first session. I was gentle in that session, and saw a need to be more direct and firm in the second session. It made all the difference and a female can do this with a high-powered male. After Thursday's class, I used the pictures of their children tool that Terry taught us for both of them. They loved it, joined together to post pictures of their children around the house, and give each other signals if they inadvertantly lapse and aren't aware of it. Thanks, Terry. It is heartwarming to witness the progress they are making. Linda Marshall/Dayton, OH
      • Not available avatar 02.20.2011 15:08
        Thanks Linda - music to my ears!!!!
    • Not available avatar 02.20.2011 09:32
      Excellent presentation! Very excited to learn about your work with couples as it will further inform the work I do with perpetrators of domestic violence. I will admit to (perhaps it's my first consciousness at work) feeling horrified about the potential ramifications to a partner who has been abused issuing an ultimatum to her abusive partner; nonetheless, I am excited about how I can use what I've learned today to help me work even more effectively with my clients. Thank you!
      • Not available avatar 02.20.2011 15:11
        I don't do couples therapy with an actively abusive partner - don't use these techniques on a dv case, please.
        • 0 avatar Kathy Miller 02.24.2011 07:53
          Understood. I was referring to what I learned about your approach as being helpful with the work that I do with perpretrators. Thanks again.
    • Not available avatar 02.20.2011 10:49
      I am slow as I had clients afterward and been busy. I once again liked the presentation. The confronting and staying with the latent has been a questionable area for me and you answered questions I needed answered. The information will be used and shared in my non-profit mental health center. Thanks you Terry. I am very glad I am participating. Most of the time I have good reception in Montana. Occasionally sound is low. I did get on after calling support with the fact the time was wrong. I appreciate the support team. Susan
      • Not available avatar 02.20.2011 15:13
        Thanks Susan.
    • Not available avatar 02.20.2011 10:58
      Great webinar - has sown some new seeds in my mind - as an executive coach I get many grandiose people who are in some form of 'trouble'. Your webinar has led me to question my adherence to goal congruence and rapport and my fear of using leverage of feedback/ brief from HR dept that places the grandiose coachee in some form of trouble. Matt Johannesburg
      • Not available avatar 02.20.2011 15:15
        Yes, I have done corporate work using this model and look forward to doing more - it's a great way to look at the workplace.
    • Not available avatar 02.20.2011 18:04
      As a beginning couples therapist I find myself reflecting on what my own beliefs are about the viability of marriage and intimate partnerships. I know this is necessary in order for me to be grounded in my work. I am really just sorting out what couples therapy is; I can see from the two presentations so far that it is partly about helping people to talk to each other. Terry, I like your comment on this post that "You cannot be intimate from the one-up or one-down position. You must have healthy self-esteem to truly love another". Since self-esteem issues can be very deep-rooted in early life experiences, I'm wondering about how it fits in RLT for partners to take time for individual psychotherapy to do their own work. I enjoyed the content of this presentation, and will pursue further information about the other RLT lenses.
      Laurie Kelly, MSW RCSW
      Whistler, British Columbia
      • Not available avatar 02.21.2011 04:04
        Thanks Laurie
        In RLT we do deep individual character transforming work (fam of origin & trauma work) in the context of the couples therapy. But how we do that is too much to discuss at this juncture, unfortunately. I have written an article that speaks to that a bit - an article on "relational mindfulness" that should be in the networker this fall.
    • Not available avatar 02.20.2011 20:08
      Terry, thank you for speaking the truth about gender inequality in a family therapy context - whew! I've found it affirming. I also am inspired to see that you have answered all the comments on this board. That takes a lot of love and commitment. It intrigued me when you wrote: i hope to be co-presenting with richard schwartz later this year in boston. Please let me know if i can purchase a copy of these interviews. I teach family therapy in Auckland, New Zealand and would appreciate using it as a resource. Cheers, Marta Fisch, Waiheke Island, NZ.
      • Not available avatar 02.21.2011 04:08
        Marta - ah, you're in david Epstein land, very nice.
        Dick & I are tentatively scheduled for late fall/early dec next year in Boston but the conference may be simulcast via web - so please stay tuned into my website for details as this develops
        • Not available avatar 02.21.2011 15:59
          Would be great to be a part of this conference. Will stay tuned to your website! SWLM, Roswell, GA
    • Not available avatar 02.21.2011 04:46
      Thanks for a great session. Terry, I love the grid and have couples and individual clients I will use this with immediately. Rich, thank you for highlighting the idea that most of our individual clients live in the bottom quadrants. Terry thanks for giving us language and tools to help those in the upper quadrants behave differently.

      Bill Doherty gave a very helpful answer to my question about alcohol abuse and Terry answered a lingering question I had about alienating an individual when I tried to set a limit within a couples session, even though deep down my intention was from a caring place, in the moment I was grandiose. Great ideas!
      Terry I was one of your Smith Family Therapy students in 1988 nice to see you present! Pat Jorgenson, Kalamazoo, Michigan
      • Not available avatar 02.21.2011 12:54
        Grandiose maybe, but I'll bet you didn't have sufficient leverage
        I say - on't be more ambitious for your clients than they are.
        I wonder if you got out ahead of a latent client. Generally I like to come in under a latent who is setting his or her own limits, rather than taking on the blatant myself.
    • Not available avatar 02.21.2011 08:06
      I really found presentation very practical, epsecially when Terry reviewed the 5 Losing vs the 5 Winning Strategies. I too can see the tie-in with Richard Schwartz's Internal Family Systems, and the practice of Mindfulness. I incorporate a DBT strategy called Moment to Pause -- which is quite simple and applicable. Risa Marlen, Teaneck, NJ
      • Not available avatar 02.21.2011 12:49
        Got it - yes, pausing is the portal to 2nd consciousness
    • Not available avatar 02.21.2011 08:51
      Finally navigated to the comment section! I just listened the Rich Simon/Terry's Real presentation. Much thanks to Rich/Psychotherapy Networker for providing opportunities in continuing education...with or without cost! Having worked in a Federal Prison with inmates, w/'grandiose' individuals in individual and couples therapy, I found Terry's approach 'right on'! I immediately ordered the book, 'The New Rules of Marriage' following the seminar. I learned a lot and much of what was presented supported my approach which isn't all that 'touchy-feely'! Usually I come from a state of compassion and "truth" as Terry define's it... This is not congruent with the approach of many therapists w/whom I work. Really appreciated the 'golden rule' -- "What do you need from me to help you give me what I want", the four quadrant approach (great way to assist both clients and myself in understanding the dynamics of the couple; "I hate how you're treating me-what can I make you for lunch" (a dynamic I frequently witness); the importance of the therapist not being "one-up" or "one down"; first and second consciousness (which reminds me of IFS' who's (what part/aspect) occupying the 'Seat of Consciousness' -- not to forget sometimes there's a blend; and finally the list of "losing" and "winning" strategies. Again, thanks for the helpful input! One quetion, what about those grandiose individuals who use withholding as opposed to acting out as a defense...would like to hear more about this stance! Susan LW Miller MS LPC LMFT NCC; Roswell, GA, USA

      • Not available avatar 02.21.2011 12:47
        Thanks Susan!
        You're describing someone in the 1-up walled off quadrant - the energy here is MEAN
        we lovingly separate the decent person underneath from these obnoxious beliefs & behaviors
    • Not available avatar 02.21.2011 10:32
      Kathy Fields, LPC in Atlanta, GA
      Loved the presentation. So useful to hear a summary of the book. Would like to hear your thoughts on working with a couple when one has some borderline tendencies. Is it possible to get the handouts that were shown during the presentation?

      Many thanks for such a practical and useful talk.
      • Not available avatar 02.21.2011 12:40
        I'm less interested in diagnosis than I am in motivation.
        I've had "borderlines" do great and run of the mill neurotics who had attitudes do not much.
        Borderlines will tend to be in the upper left quadrant - 1-up and boundaries. They need help with boundaries and staying moderate - all doable (if there's leverage)
    • 0 avatar Carol D'Andrea 02.21.2011 13:44
      I love that I don't have to see each person as equally responsible, the ideas of latent and blatant, empowering the latent person, teaching mindful responses... This helped me put a framework on a lot of what I've been trying to do with couples, but gives me a much more structured approach. Excellent! Carol, Queens, NY
      • Not available avatar 02.22.2011 16:13
        Love hearing I'm helping therapists do what they were doing anyway.
        I'll be starting an RLI supervision group in NY btw.
        Thanks for your kind words
    • Not available avatar 02.21.2011 18:38
      I just listened to the web broadcast and it was really terrific ,coherent and well thought out. What do you do if after several sessions the Latent is not willing to put their foot down and to follow through with serious negative consequences for no change? Where do you go from there? Teri from San Jose Ca
      • Not available avatar 02.22.2011 16:15
        Thanks Teri
        I'd meet w the latent a few times alone, see if he or she can be nudged.
    • 0 avatar Kathleen Waegner 02.22.2011 10:36
      I appreciated this presentation very much. The tables and diagrams are very helpful. I can see the value in engaging the couple in identifying where they would place themselves on the relationship grid and in determining what their losing strategies are. The relational mindfulness of this approach blends well with the Contemplative Therapy of my practice. Thank you for these tools.

      Kathleen Santa Rosa, CA
      • Not available avatar 02.22.2011 16:16
        Thanks Kathleen
    • Not available avatar 02.22.2011 15:11
      I especially appreciated the labelling of "Grandiosity" -- someone I know who is a "pompous ass" (still boasts of punching the high school principal decades later) came to mind. I think we still have a lot of work to bring people up from shame, since I've seen too many people in the counselling field themselves coming from shame. I wonder if there is any way to bring Grandiosity more to light, in general, so that it is no longer as easy to ignore signs of one's own grandiosity. I would like the slide of the Grandiosity/Shame and Walled off/Boundaryless chart if possible. Thanks. Lorill - White Rock, British Columbia.
      • Not available avatar 02.22.2011 16:22
        Thanks for your thoughts Lorill.
        Chart can be found in The New Rules of Marriage
    • 0 avatar Ruth Bergen Braun 02.23.2011 03:27
      I'm currently working with a couple who have been married over 50 years. He is definately the blatant and certainly during their marriage fits the description of grandiosity. He is, however, filled with remorse and regret over what he did to his family and particularly his wife who he still loves very much. She, on the other hand, is full to the brim of pain. In spite of his remorse, grandiosity is his default and he continues to hurt her. How do I address this while still holding him in his regret and remorse? (I've only been seeing couples for a year so am open to any and all suggestions.)
    • Not available avatar 02.23.2011 07:59
      I appreciate his feelings &, evidently, he's still hurting her - he needs to hook
      remorse w resolve and stop behaving badly.
    • 0 avatar Nick Child 03.07.2011 01:52
      Catching up late with my webinars here in Scotland, as I am with my belated self-arranged couple counselling training to add to my self-arranged family therapy training. It takes some effort to get out of the pull of one's own world and thinking and training and influences. These webinars are simultaneously like another big planet with the gravitational attraction to make that job easy, as well as another world in terms of how I've found things in the UK - as I said before, the distance and ignorance between what should be two very married fields of family and couple therapy.

      The bold energetic determined open and intelligent development of "schools" of thought and practice in the US is a great inspiration and model for our more tentative and welfare state based ways in the UK. As an innovative child and family psychiatrist in the NHS one also needed to be bold energetic etc, so it is great to be reminded and "allowed" to be those things again - that is, in contrast to the moderation of the original "master" family therapists that has rightly been the direction of the field of family therapy.

      But I can hold onto both the inspiration and encouragement to be bold and directive again, as well as reflect that maybe some couples or some client groups and the therapists they get drawn to and even some cultures might not be ready for or fit a particular model of couple therapy. So I'm enjoying expanding my already broad repertoire of therapeutic theory and practice here. And I know that being eclectic means I'll never be particularly good at any of them!!

      Nick Child, Family Therapist, Edinburgh Scotland.
    • 0 avatar chris cable 03.07.2011 08:54
      I read Terry Real's book on male depression years ago, and for the first time, was able to feel REAL empathy for men. In fact, I became the female co-leader of a YWCA Anger Management course that the court would send men to. Now I want to learn more about direct talking with couples. I really enjoyed this session.
      Chris Cable, Annapolis MD
    • Not available avatar C. O. 08.04.2011 12:01
      I have done couples counselling for many years, and have always struggled with co-ordinating skills with deeper emotion focussed/family of origin work--both seem important to me. This model appears to combine both and I will certainly be studying it further.
      I have tried to combine truth/love in my work with couples over the years and believe that we are doing couples a disservice if we do not. Great webinar.
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