P001 New Perspectives on Trauma Treatment

This blog focuses on discussion regarding the course, P001 New Perspectives on Trauma Treatment

P001: The Frontiers of Trauma Treatment Web Series

Thank you to everyone who attended today’s session of New Perspectives on Trauma Treatment.  This session--and this Comment Board!--is an integral part of the collective learning process we’re all embarking on together, in order to understand the changing world around us.

Please take a minute to tell us about what stood out for you during today’s session--a piece of useful information or a thought-provoking anecdote. Or, share with us what will most impact your professional or personal life.

Please share with us whatever you felt was most striking about today’s webinar and, to create a better sense of community, we invite you to include your name and hometown with your comment. Thank you all so much for your participation and inspiring thoughts.

10.05.2010   Posted In: P001 New Perspectives on Trauma Treatment   By Psychotherapy Networker
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    • 0 avatar aimee rozum 10.20.2010 07:03
      Thank You, this was a very informative session and has inspired me to get my certification.
      Aimee Loth Rozum LMHC, ATR-BC
      Cape Cod, MA
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    • Not available avatar 10.20.2010 07:08
      Good Afternoon,
      I think what stood out for me the most in this session was how EMDR can be readily integrated in the treatment of trauma. Previously I had thought of EMDR as a seperate modality used separately. I now recognize its usefulness in application to a broad spectrum of both diagnoses and treatments. The most striking fact I learned today is the fact that EMDR can affect diagnoses which were previously thought to be "monolithic," as Ms. Shapiro put it--Axis II diagnoses particularly, but also the whole area of sex offenders. I currently work with the military and their families in regard to the effects of combat--while my present occupation does not allow for my use of a full spectrum of clinical interventions, (scope of program is limited), I believe that as I move towards a clinical position once again, I will do so with EMDR as a treatment at the forefront of my interventions. Thank you so much for this very informative and illuminative session.
      • 0 avatar Elizabeth Magnus 11.03.2010 07:14
        I very much enjoyed the simplicity of the techniques, discussed in very clear language, so that clients could do things for themselves and teach them to others. I also liked the emphasis on stabilization so that people aren't unncessarily retraumatized. That is one of the things I like about EMDR. There is a titration process built in, at least in the way I use it. Also I was very impressed with the way the presenter thinks and the clear manner in which she presents her system.Thank you for a wonderful presentation. Elizabeth Magnus, Ph.D. Licensed Psychologist Janesville, Wisconsin 11/2/10 (Presentation 3)
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    • 0 avatar Jennifer Elf 10.20.2010 07:08
      Intrigued to re-investigate EMDR since trained in 1993; since much research in EMDR, affective neuroscience and information processing has been going on. Appreciated the overview & am planning to update my skillset w/ EMDR.
      J. Elf, MS, Bothell WA
    • Not available avatar 10.20.2010 07:11
      I especially appreciated learning the 8 stages of EMDR. I am very novice in the area of EMDR - but this put the process in a better perspective for me. I am planning on taking the training. I also was interested in the fact that verbalizing during the process is not necessary??? Maybe more clarification on this would be good.

      Patti Hagarty - Grande Prairie, AB, Canada
    • 0 avatar Deborah Clague 10.20.2010 08:22
      I was struck by the reframing of trauma and of PTSD as "symptoms as unprocessed memories" is a wonderfully tangible and practical/practicable concept. I was also amazed that after EMDR there is evidence of hippocampal growth. That is evidence based! Thank you for organizing this series!

      Deborah Clague
      New Portland, ME
    • Not available avatar 10.20.2010 09:58
      Deborah -
      Bessel Van der Kolk did some amazing research into trauma memory in the brain w/ a fmri study & found that when one is having a flashback of their trauma, left-brain is inactive (especially language center) and right brain is activated. Post-treatment (I believe he used EMDR in the study I heard him report on) - the person could think of their trauma & no flashback would occur - and fmri would not show that dramatic L-R difference.
      Jenny Elf
      Bothell, WA
    • 0 avatar Bea Hollander-Goldfein 10.20.2010 12:38
      Always excellent to learn about a treatment approach in the context of its development and in the context of the development of the field. I would have appreciated having the slides in advance to make notetaking easier. And - is it ever possible to have these webinars with a visual of the speaker on the computer or is this not possible? Thanks for a relevant webinar series.
      Bea Hollander-Goldfein Ph.D., LMFT
      Philadelphia, Pa
    • 0 avatar Lois Mitchell 10.21.2010 11:46
      I tried to take in everything from the session but would like to listen again. Is that link available for review? I continue to be a sceptic but also see the power of mind-body connection/physical activity to enact feelings and would like to know more.
      Lois of Fairfax, Virginia
      • 0 avatar Lynda Ruf 10.22.2010 11:17
        There are 20 randomized controlled trials supporting the use of EMDR in the
        treatment of trauma.  It is endorsed as a front line treatment in practice
        guidelines globally, including by the American Psychiatric Association.
        Here's the link to the studies:


        As a result of her work and contributions to the field, Dr. Shapiro received the Award for Outstanding Contributions to Practice in Trauma Psychology from the American Psychological Association Trauma Division.

        I too was skeptical, but have found it to be a very powerful therapy. Because of the integrative aspect, I was able to incorporate my previous training experiences into EMDR and now self identify as an EMDR therapist. I have yet to find a clinical issue, however simple or complex, for which EMDR isn't highly relevant and effective. The Adaptive Information Processing model is a very useful guide in conceptualizing cases and though I may never get to the desensitization Phases 4-6 with clients (for a variety of reasons identified in Phase 2), both the client and I benefit from EMDR. All I can say is "seeing is believing" and I am an honored witness to miracles on a daily basis.

        Lynda Ruf, Florida
    • 0 avatar Alicia Gonzalez 10.27.2010 07:05
      Thanks for the session on sensorimotor psychotherapy. It was very interesting and Pat Ogden was very engaging. I am going to follow up on this, with the hope of getting more of her training.
      Alicia Gonzalez, N Carolina
    • 0 avatar Bea Hollander-Goldfein 10.27.2010 07:58
    • 0 avatar Bea Hollander-Goldfein 10.27.2010 08:05
      This was a very interesting and important seminar. As a therapist and trauma researcher I believe that this approach needs to be more integral to psychotherapy education as should the other mind/body approaches. I would like to see an integrated framework that ties in these approaches on a continuum of practice. For example - the relationship between EFT and sensorimotor psychotherapy. They are not on different continuum - they are on the same continuum, so how do we conceptualize the relationship between them. What are the therapeutic elements and what is the progression of therapy and where do they intersect. Also, what is the intersection of experience, affect and cognition. Either one alone is insufficient. New for me in today's talk was the concept of "window of safety" and how to move between the hyperarousal and hypoarousal. I also wish there were more local (Philadelphia) training options. I work on the integration every time I do a therapy session. I would love to dialogue about this with colleagues.
      Thank you for this opportunity,
      Bea Hollander-Goldfein, Philadelphia, Pa.
    • Not available avatar 10.27.2010 09:23
      The exercise of putting a hand on the tummy and one on the chest is great . T
      the first client i tried it with, after attending a session of Pat's in Edmonton, spontaneously said - this is like holding my baby, ,,,, and got teary over the lovely memories evoked of holding his infant children - and this was a tall, tough military veteran. Now when I use this, sometimes I will add this babyholding part of the story - and wow - what powerful reactions - stories of holding new born babies, puppies, kittens - often complete with body memories of smells, sensations etc. And of course sadly, not so gentle stories of lost babies ,,,,,

      The simple yet eloquent power of the body is so wonderful and so respectful - thanks Pat. The integration is so crucial. Liz Massiah, Edmonton, Alberta Canada ( and yes it has snowed already )
    • Not available avatar 11.02.2010 13:40
      I found it to be a very good reminder of allowing physical clues to add to my understanding and perception of where a client is.
      I really like the hand on tummy and chest.

      Lisa Smith San Diego, CA.
    • Not available avatar 11.02.2010 14:04
      The work that Pat Ogden is doing is very important.Window of tolerance not able to be obtained with just talk therapy-important stuff and very much tied to brain research.I am curious to learn how to apply sensori psychotherapy to children.
    • Not available avatar 11.02.2010 14:32
      This type of body work really resonates with me, because I know how beneficial yoga can be, which emphasizes exploring your edge, connecting with your breath to tell you when to push harder, and when to pull back. Thank you so much, Pat
    • Not available avatar 11.02.2010 14:36
      wonderful presentation, informative and educational. I will apply some of the techniques with my patients who have been traumatized either by abuse, neglect or wars
      Hoda Amine, PhD, LMSW
    • Not available avatar 11.02.2010 14:54
      I am wondering how SP relates to the modality called Somatic Experiencing. I am really paying more attention to the body now. Would someone know how these two therapies relate? Judith Morse, LCSW
    • Not available avatar 11.02.2010 16:24
      I have been in practice for 35 years and have completed the Sensorimotor Psychotherapy training in the past several years. The integration of the somatic into verbal therapy has been invaluable in my work with clients. I only wish is had come years ago! It has been by far the most valuable training I have ever done. SPI trainers come from a place of respect and integrity with a wealth of skills to share in treating the whole person. Thanks for including Pat Ogden in this seminar.
    • Not available avatar 11.02.2010 17:47
      As LPC's are often legally limited to working in group settings, it would be interesting to know how to keep a safe window of tolerance to benefit traumatized individuals with sensorimotor bottom up tools in the group. Pam O'Brien, LPC
      • Not available avatar 11.03.2010 09:58
        I am a certified Sensorimotor and hakomi therapist and work with the group model developed by a previous SPI trainer called Deirdre Fay. The group is called Becoming Safely Embodied and you can get the manual through Amazon. We work with developing skills such as mindfulness, staying in the window of Tolerance, naming sensations, feelings thoughts, working with triggers etc. Excellent work.
    • Not available avatar 11.03.2010 01:44
      There are many similarities between emdr and sensorimotor psychotherapy. Emdr is a technique that keeps the patient in the window of tolerance and processes at all levels including the sensorimotor level as a body scan and subsequent processing is always part of the therapy. I find the butterfly flap is as effective as eye movement for bilateral stimulation and allows the therapist to better observe the reactions in therapy at a sensorimotor level so the they can be interpreted ( to oneself) and later processed.
      Graham Hocking Australia
      • 0 avatar Rebecca Chesin 11.17.2010 06:22
        What is the "butterfly flap"?
        • Not available avatar 11.25.2010 00:47
          Butterfly flap is putting your arms crossed over your chest and tapping with your palms alternatively on each side of your chest. My first knowledge of it was it's use on children in south America after an earth quake. I asked Francine Shapiro about its use generally in EMDR and she it was appropriate to use so I have been using it since. Particularly useful in children and adolescents. I also note that guru Tony Robbins has incorporated into his repertoire.

          Graham Hocking Australia
    • Not available avatar 11.03.2010 05:06
      Excellent presentations, both EMDR, and Sensorimotor Psychotherapy. I have been away from Mental Health for a few years and luckily have been out of work for the past month. I have reintroduced myself to the massive research and information available. Personally, I had movement therapy for many years and a course of rolfing. Putting concepts to the healing that takes place has been nothing less than a miracle to me, since my training is medical. Thank the universe for spiritual evolution!!
      Kay Homer, Occoquan, VA
    • Not available avatar 11.03.2010 07:15
      Due to budget restrictions I signed up for the "free" track. Both the EMDR and the Sensorimotor sessions have been so valuable. Thank you for making them possible.
    • 0 avatar Terry Kottler 11.03.2010 07:34
      This method seems to hold great promise. I liked the accent on normalizing symptoms, promoting independence and enhancing self regulation. Has this been tried with the spouse community of the military? This might be another way to get returning veterans the help they need.
      Terry Kottler, LCSW
      Herndon, Virginia
    • Not available avatar 11.03.2010 09:27
      As a non-traditional (age 55) grad student in Professional Counseling (14 of 20 courses completed), my goal is to be prepared to "hit the ground running" when I begin work as a counselor. As such, I have found the Psychotherapy Networker-sponsored webinars to be very helpful in that regard. I had read quite a bit on this topic previously, including some of Pat Ogden's material, so I counted it a real "plus" to hear her present examples of how she would incorporate sensorimotor principles & techniques in the midst of a therapeutic session.

      I tend to take rather extensive notes, and found the slides to be very helpful. They would have been even more valuable had they been shown on the screen for a longer period: some were visible for less than a second, and were thus unable to be retrieved & viewed even with placing the webinar on "pause" and scrolling backwards through the presentation. Another listener commented on the value of the slides as well, yet how they would have been of even greater value if they were made more accessible to us. I second that sentiment.

      Thank you for these excellent presentations. I'm looking forward to learning even more from the remainder of this series.
    • 0 avatar Polly Bloomberg 11.08.2010 15:45
      I had a very frustrating time with the audio in this presentation. It played for a while and then it stopped, just as I was learning something important. I could not get it started again. Then, on its own, it would suddenly start up, but not where it left off. Then I tried downloading it, rather than just listening directly from the site. I downloaded this talk and instead got Francine Shapiro, which I already had. Help!
    • Not available avatar 11.09.2010 08:09
      Excellent presentation by Pat Ogden. I am inspired and excited by Sensorimotor Psychotherapy. Thanks for offering these free webinars, much appreciated!
    • 0 avatar Pamela O'Brien 11.24.2010 06:13
      It was striking that no-one seems to have commented on Don Meichenbaum's nagativity about so called energy based therapies such as EFT and TFT in the treatment of PTSD. Perhaps these approaches are not so evidence-based as CBT or even EMDR because no-one will fund what they believe to be the approaches of charlatans, as EMDR was once thought to be. It seems to me that we don't know if certain approaches are valid in the treatment of PTSD because, as Bessel van der Kolk might say, they are not thought to "exist". Would welcome discussion among the presenters.
      Pam O'Brien, LPC
      Washington, DC
    • 0 avatar Burke Hunter 11.24.2010 14:14
      Unfortunately, being overseas, I found that the tight time frame for downloading or listening made it difficult to hear each speaker. What I was able to listen to I have appreciated and enjoyed. Burke
    • Not available avatar 11.24.2010 19:32
      Firstly, thought field therapy (TFT) has real provenance in clinical psychology - Roger Callahan was one of Albert Ellis' closest associates in the early 60s (see Acknowledgments in Reason & Emotion in Psychotherapy (1962)). So we are not talking about charlatans here.
      Secondly, Don Meichenbaum has been a significant positive influence on my work as a clinical psychologist for decades. His book with Turk & Genest has been a blueprint for my considerable work with chronic pain clients for countless years.
      Now I wish to comment on his assertion that TFT should be "avoided". It seems to me that if we are going to be true to ourselves as scientists that we do so across the board. Marcello Truzzi comments on this saying "In science, the burden of proof falls upon the claimant."
      The proponents of TFT and the generic umbrella energy psychology (EP) are diligently establishing an evidence base. David Feinstein's two reviews (2008 & 2010) document these efforts. His 2008 paper presented 17 studies. Feinstein (200 said: "Every study I could find, published and unpublished, from systematic clinical observation to RCTs . . . lends support for the efficacy of tapping while mentally attuned to an emotional difficulty" (p. 264).
      Meichenbaum's statement "avoid TFT", it seems to me, is of the nature of a claim rather than of an agnostic position, and thereby comes with a burden of proof - it requires some evidence-based facts to support it.
      We need to know of any evidence, for example, of harm that has arisen; of treatment failures; and of lack of endurance over time of any initial positive changes that might have been achieved. This evidence may be documented or from Don's own, or his associates', applications of TFT.
      Some of the "critisisms that go on" that Don would have us outline at the beginning of our presentations (I actually do) are quite frankly an embarrassment to the expectation of rigourous science and cogent critical thinking e.g., Norcross et al (2006); Cukor et al (200 and much of the criticism in the J Clin Psych edition of 2001.
      I welcome debate on these issues but my experience has been that critics seem debate-averse.
      Christopher Semmens, Perth, Western Australia.
    • 0 avatar H. Jacobsen, ATR, LCSW 11.26.2010 05:49
      Totally fantastic!! Thanks so much for putting this together.
      Heather Jacobsen, ATR, LCSW
      New York, NY
  • Not available avatar 11.28.2010 05:37
    Thank you for making this series of free webinars available. This is exactly the kind of general enrichment that should be made available to therapists in the field. Whether or not I believe everything or find any of it directly useful to me, having these ideas articulated by their various proponents is professionally and educationally refreshing. So, thank you, Psychotherapy Networker, for keeping the networking lines open!
    Caryn, Oxnard, CA
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